Second Order Podcast

Nate Dinet

Second Order is a podcast for technology founders, COOs, and operations leaders who want to understand what actually happens between closing a deal and delivering on it. Hosted by Nate Dinet of The Step Manager, each episode features honest conversations with CEOs, heads of business operations, and senior executives at SaaS companies, AI-native startups, and tech services firms. Covering delivery chaos at scale, the founder bottleneck, bespoke traps that erode margins, and when to invest in technology versus people — if the gap between selling and delivering is where things get messy, Second Order is where you'll find the frameworks and hard-won insight to close it.